i was seeing the thread these days and just noticed something,you only got the all wands id'd in the run you talked about there,what about the all ring id'd?why didn't you got it in the same run?i did so,why dont you make it too?
Hi and Shadow Automaton asked me to ask you about this. How do you manage degradation? Right now I'm in D-14 with a +5 Scale Armor and a Scroll of Upgrade (am saving it until the armor starts to break) and what happens if you can't find another Scroll of Upgrade once the armor breaks and I use the one I have now, and with a Scroll of Enchantment I might get Multiplicity?
You only need to get your armour to depth 20. Once you defeat the dwarf king you're totally set, he'll drop the armour kit and your armour will never degrade again! My recomendation is essentially keep on going like you are (asuming you have a reasonable weapon. You want to get a weight stone from the shop and weight your weapon for damage not speed (can also use this to repair the weapon) at this point you're going to have to ignore any rings you have, it's not worth putting any upgrades into them. If you have evasion and such then I suggest un equiping them and only using them when you need to.
If youo're having no luck with upgrade scrolls then I suggest you start shuffling items. Find another set of lesser armour that you can switch to when you're not fearing for your life, and only equip the scale when something looks like it's going to hurt a LOT. With the DM-300 you're going to want to try and do some DOT stuff to him. Unless your weapon is amazing you're going to take quite a few hits to the armour. How many HP pots do you have? Too late to farm them now I guess. But see how you go.
You need to make sure that your weapon doesn't degrade. Keep it at about the +7 to +8 mark ish for optimal performance (any more and it will start degrading really quickly) but this needs to be priority over your armour. You can live without armour, you CAN'T live without your weapon.
You're probably going to be shocked I still have a +0 venomous short sword.
The dungeon only has a degraded cursed quarterstaff and overpriced maces in both shops (only 1 point more damage than the short sword and the D-11 one costs over 1000 gold.)
Edit: I beat something like 30 skeletons in depths 6-9 and not one of them dropped a weapon.
Yeah you're going to have some serious troubles with the DM-300 my friend. You may have to drop the upgrade into the weapon and the enchantment into the armour just to beat him and screw the rest of the run.. At least you'll unlock the warden ey.
I never buy weapons from the shop, way to expensive, better off with Health potions and utility items.
I'm surprised that you haven't found any better weapon though. That's pretty unlucky!
See how you go man, I'd just focus on trying to beat the DM-300. Unless you get a nice weapon drop on like depth 21 early on, the monks and golumns are going to slaughter you and no matter how good your armour is you'll be taking so many hits that it will just degrade really fast :/ sorry
Good effort so far though! Next time you play through with a weapon you'll be like skipping through a field of daisies haha
See Zehren's message wall, I described it there. I beat DM-300!
Though I got killed by a dwarf warlock on D-19. There was a summoning trap blocking off a section of the depth and I accidentally stepped on it. It summoned a fire elemental and a golem and I ran away but got trapped by another elemental and a warlock killed me.
It probably wouldn't even have happened if Hero's Remains gave me my old +1 War Hammer instead of the Mail Armor from the last game. That’s my luck.
CJTC wrote: ... I'm starting to feel like Watabou is slightly high when he does these updates haha.
Why would that be intentional?!
..*Shrug* Other than for reasons of logical consistency, I can't even begin to fathom what goes on in Watabou's mind when he makes decisions like these..
Like, O lets make the game easier by essentially getting rid of the shop system... ... ... I don't even
And ↑ that ↑, in a (more general) nutshell, is essentially my problem with, and the cause of, the tumultuous, mercurial cycle of balance that this game has, in its latter days. Or rather the lack of clear, guided balance.
[WARNING: Soapbox/Rant starts here.]
Watabou adds in a new mechanism that has the effect of making the game easier (but wasn't really needed by most competent players, 'cept perhaps the vocal newbs/casuals who might've complained, rather than learn the game's mechanisms - e.g. "Dew Vial"),
then in order to counter-balance that new addition (perhaps because of a large group of veterans who might've complained that the game had lost what made it fun - its difficulty - rather than simply not using the new item), Watabou adds another mechanism in an attempt to make it difficult again, but only ends up swinging the game's difficulty way too far in the other direction, making the game nigh undesirable to play (e.g. Degradation System).
Then from there to now, the cycle starts anew & we're back to things being (relatively) easier because of this new mechanism added to the Scroll of Wipe Out.
It almost seems as if he no longer knows what to address, in order to truly balance the game; and is only reactively "putting out fires" (treating symptoms), rather than proactively preventing fires from occurring in the first place (curing the disease).
In regards to the Dew Vial, he could've addressed the issue that the Dew Vial was created to solve, by either:
overhauling the Ankh to function like the current Dew Vial (so the Ankh doesn't become obsolete, and there aren't any superfluous items, avoiding creating the Dew Vial in the first place), or
He also could've done follow-up balancing in regards to the Dew Vial, by either:
Removing the obsolete/no-longer-relevant Ankh, or
Switching the spawning of the Ankh & Dew Vial, so that the Dew Vial could only be purchased at the first Shop, while the Ankh could be found randomly only in the Sewer stage. (Doing this would've made the difficulty feel like it scales better as the player descends deeper into the dungeon.)
In regards to the Degradation System, he could've approached it differently, by implementing its second iteration from the start (the item breaks, rather than losing its upgrade value; items degrade significantly slower), but by also providing a common new item/means of repairing degraded items, separate from the current items that can repair them, like perhaps the Dark Gold Ore (which provides a heavier reason for mining them, and allows us to keep the Pickaxe & keep coming back to the Troll Blacksmith for repairs), or even a new item altogether, so we don't have to cut into our limited supply of Upgrade scrolls, Enchantment scrolls, & Weightstones.
As for the Scroll of Wipe out.. I would've been satisfied with only Mimics being affected by the scroll, rather than also the Shopkeeper (& Quest NPCs). If it'd only affected enemies, it would've been fine.
But oh well *shrug*.. since it seems intended, Watabou better not patch any 'exploit' we may find for it (since it seems he only quickly pounces on removing exploits, rather than prioritizing fixing the other more-serious, game-breaking bugs, or implementing better balancing).
Initially when everyone started modding I was like 'coll but I'm still playing the origional'. But now days everyone (especially on the reddit) plays Shattered because of exactly what you're saying.
Evan balanced the dew vial really nicely by making you use it with the ankh to provide the free revive. I really like that. It's just a fillable potion on it's own.
To be blatently honest I actually thinkn the last update destroyed the game completely. The Degredation model was HARD but still usable. But the way it is now you can literally only use upgraded item! There's no options anymore. You have to roll with subpar armour till the dwarf king so that you actually have a weapon that works in the latter levels. I'm more than happy to let my +9 Glaive degrade to +8 during the demon halls. In fact I would do that as part of a strategy. But currently that's not an option. Don't have an upgrade scroll handy for end game? To bad, your weapon now does nothing...
You're right, I feel like he's just reacting to random stuff now rather than thinking through the game.
At this point I'm seriously following Evans work because he's doing everything we wanted from Watabou, the new mage rework, traps, item balancing.. Evans is an easier game than even the origional PD post dewvial update but at least is feels a bit more balanced.
Vanilla PD is now a destructively hard game with a bunch of completely over powered items in it to try and counter that. Shattered is a reasonably hard game with more balanced items that you can use in the right situations.
Watabou: DEWVIAL THAT GIVES YOU INSTA REVIVE!
Evan: Ooorr refillable potion that when combined with an expensive shop baught item can revive you somewhat?
Watabou: CRAZY STRONG BEE THAT IS YOUR MINION ON THIS LEVEL
Evan: Ooooor summon agressive semi controlable neutral that may help but may kill you?
Watabou: BOMBS THAT CAN TAKE OUT A BOSS IN A FEW THROWS!
Evan: Ooooor bombs that might paralyse for a turn but don't do crazy damage.
Watabou: ARMOUR DEGREDATION BECAUSE IT"S ALL TOO EASY AFTER THESE AWESOME ITEMS!
It's a hard one.
I'm actually kind of waiting for Watabou to try and recind his acceptance of Modding, but I get the feeling that he doesn't care enough about this game to make an issue of the mod being more sucessful.. :/
CJTC wrote: In fact I would do that as part of a strategy.
It's too bad no one stepped forward & shared/posted a sound, in-depth strategy guide in managing Item Degradation at specific points in the game, before the 2nd version of the Degradation system was implemented.
It likely would've stemmed a big portion of the backlash on the first version of the system (likely preventing the 2nd version from manifesting), if more people had a firm grasp on the exact points (in time/in the dungeon) of when to repair their items, and when to ration their item-repairing items. (e.g. Right before a boss fight? Immediately after a boss fight? Every five depths including & starting from Depth 3? et c.)
I would've written one myself, but I chose not to upgrade past 1.7.3c cause I foresaw what the introduction of the Degradation system would mean for my gameplay from then on; and I don't have any other devices to test the system out on, so yeah. =/
It's too bad no one stepped forward & shared/posted a sound, in-depth strategy guide in managing Item Degradation at specific points in the game
Yeah my bad.. I had a script and everything ready for a video but never got around to it. Screen cap problems then I was a way for a while :/
To be honest though there didn't seem many people interested in guides. Either they wanted to complain and switched imidiately to Mods or they jsut played anyway. There's still people winning plenty with the current update. Hell I finished with each class just to prove it's possible. But the game is very stale now later on. You upgrade your weapon... That's it. You hope for a reasonable ring that works when broken (detection or haste) but can't afford to drop much into it.
CJTC wrote: Jeez that was a big post! Well done! haha
XD It was, but it's relatively around the same length as the other two Boss Guides I wrote prior to it.
Yog-Dzewa will be the longest of them all (about 4x as long as the other Boss Guides), since I'll be writing all the different strategies for 4 different approaches: Melee-Fists 1st, Melee-Eye 1st, Ranged-Fists 1st, & Ranged-Eye 1st. (x_x)
LoL Thanks, man! They take a lot of time & thought to write, so I appreciate it! =D
Btw.. Been a while! Welcome back, man! Your presence here has been missed. Hahah
Yeah man! Big undertaking, good effort!
Is eye first ranged take down actually possible without like a million invis potions?? I've only ever done ranged take downs using invis potions for the fists?
Yeah after finishing the Rings and Wands and then completing the 'all challenges in one run' I thought I'd give it a bit of a break for a while. Played some shattered for a bit and been busy with work.
But then I found out about the item degradation and went.. maybe this will make things harder again!
What do you think on the mini vid series idea? Would you be interested in helping with strategy? I've recorded two full runs with Warlock and Assassin already, and the accompanying 4 stupid deaths at various stages of the game.
Don't know if you have a screen recorder on your phone or tablet but any extra footage would be cool. My phone doesn't seem quite powerful enough to run a full res recording without stuttering on PD haha. Makes for some fun missclicks, but I've resorted to bad quality smoother resolutions.
CJTC wrote: Is eye first ranged take down actually possible without like a million invis potions??
Not with Missile Weapons/Physical Damage (i.e. Boomerang).
Only Combat Wands/Magic Damage (i.e. Laser, Fire, Electricity, & Poison) + an Earthroot seed + P-Gas potions, works with the Ranged-Eye 1st approach.
(Physical Damage forces Larvae to spawn, while Magic Damage does not, as stated in the Tips section on Y-D's page.)
But..uhh..that'll be in the guide once it's up.. (You sly guy, you! Getting the strategy out of me, before I even post the guide! XD Hahah; JK.)
But then I found out about the item degradation and went.. maybe this will make things harder again!
Then perhaps a masochist like yourself would enjoy Post-1.7.4 Pixel Dungeon. XD Xb
Regarding your recent thread, I'll reply there, so it brings visibility to it. =)
Yeah I have been playing since earlier. This was taken on a new phone. Replaced my old one and thus lost all my previous data. So It looks quite funny. But To be honest this is already after over 400 games or so ;)